Fargo is an ear treat for music lovers. Together, composer Jeff Russo and music supervisor Maggie Phillips create a world with just the right amount of playfulness and tragedy. There is a distinct tone to the music of Fargo.
For years, Phillips has helped series creator Noah Hawley and FX create immediately unforgettable moments in television with both Legion and Fargo. With the latter, the Emmy-nominated music supervisor from Texas gets to heighten all the emotions on screen. “It’s this Fargo universe that the Coen brothers created and we exist in, so we don’t have to be naturalistic,” Phillips told Immersive. “We don’t have to be character driven. Yes, we keep these characters in mind, but we’re okay with pulling ourselves out of it and saying, this is the filmmaker’s take on this situation and we’re going to have fun with it.”
Recently, Phillips told Immersive about the fun, as well as the negotiations involved, in bringing her punk rock sensibility to Fargo.
I was happy to learn that the use of Kris Krisstofferson’s “Help Me Make it Through the Night” in Fat City is your favorite song choice in a movie.
Oh my God. I can’t believe you found that in an interview. That is one of my all time favorites. No one’s brought that up in an interview.
It’s such a great, deeply sad movie.
I know. Most songs I gravitate to have feelings of sadness, but then the way that song was used throughout that film, I don’t think I’ll ever top that.
Before we get into Fargo, just curious, what really speaks to you as a music supervisor about that song choice?
Honestly, it’s that song in particular. I was born and raised in Texas, and so country music and Kris Krristofferson and Willie Nelson, The Highwaymen, meant a lot to me growing up. That’s the music my dad played for me. So, it’s a familiar sound, but then that song in particular, I can relate to it.
I loved that song before I saw the movie and then I saw the movie, and then the way they use that and in the opening credits, are just so profound. And then the way they kept bringing it back, it was like a theme. That song was used as a theme throughout. I don’t think anyone’s done that since.
Growing up in Austin, Texas, how’d the music scene inspire you?
I’m a 13th generation Texan. As fucked up as Texas is right now, politically, there is a pride with Texas and our roots. The reason I’m a music supervisor is because I grew up in Austin, Texas. The music I was exposed to at an early age from my parents, and then growing up in Austin in the ’90s… My parents were so cool. They used to take me to shows and drop me off to go see live shows when I was 16, 17. My love of music was always present. I mean, there’s a whole story about how I became a music supervisor.
The Duplass Brothers, right?
Yeah. Before them, I was immersed in that [music] world. Actually, my background is in visual art. I went to school to be a painter and I painted for the first 10 years of my life, from 20 to 30. And then from 30 on, I did music supervision, but music was always what I wish I could have done. I don’t have a musical bone in my body, but I have good ears and can curate well.
I feel very attached to artists, and I guess that’s how I connected with the Duplass Brothers. Mark, who was a musician in Austin back in the ‘90s, I connected with. His drummer went to art school with me, and Mark used to serve me coffee outside the coffee cart in front of the art building.
It was like when you’re just in your twenties and you’re making art and you don’t think about what’s going to happen next. You don’t think about where we’re going to go, just all making art and excited about it. So, that’s how it started.
At that time, were you into a lot of rock music? I ask because Fargo has some good rock tunes.
No, back then I was fully immersed in the indie art scene, indie music scene. It was in the ’90s. I was so immersed in the Austin indie scene in the ’90s, and then I moved to New York around 2000. It was so much fun. I was just a fan. I was the friend that was making mixed CDs at that point for friends, and I was a geek about it. And back then, we didn’t have Spotify. We didn’t have any algorithms, so the way you discovered music was getting on blogs or reading liner notes of albums.
For me, that was a hobby. I’ve discovered all these new bands, so when Mark and Jay tapped me early on, it was because I was the geek who was reading all the blogs and knew about new bands. And then, my love for music expanded and grew as my career grew.
How’d you connect with Noah Hawley over music?
We met years later, but we had that shared sort of Texas background, even though he’s not from Texas, but he knew a lot about Texas music because of his wife is from there. I got brought on for Fargo season two.
I still always say, and I will never probably change, my favorite music is from ’65 to ’82. That’s my sweet spot of music. If I’m going to be listening to music just for myself, it’s that time period. And so, when Noah and I met, we bonded a lot on that period of music.
I talked to him once about the use of The B-52’s in Lucy in the Sky. He said “My Own Private Idaho” was the character’s internal music. Do you make similar song choices for the ensemble on Fargo?
I think Lucy in the Sky is different. I think he was much more in the character mindset with Lucy. He might disagree, but Fargo, yes, the characters are constantly in mind, but it’s more about commentary on the characters. The music is a character in and of itself, so it’s not as character-driven. It’s thematically-driven. With Fargo, we’re given this gift of being able to comment in a way that other stories can’t. You can’t do that in Lucy in the Sky. Does that make sense?
It does. Different tone. Maybe Noah would disagree, but it’s a more politically-charged chapter of Fargo. There’s a lot of great political music from that time period you mentioned. Was that on your mind at all?
We knew what we were doing. I think Noah, as he says, we’re not poking fun. We’re not making fun. We are just presenting the world we are in now. He has said, “This is the Tiger King of World America.” I think characters like Roy Tillman, who they represent, would choose songs like YMCA without understanding the irony behind it. We were just presenting the truth of what the world is we exist in now.
Why’d you stop at ‘82? Did a really bad album or something come out in ‘83?
Once you get into ‘82, ‘83, ‘84, you go more New Wave. I am a punk girl.
Does that punk rock sensibility influence Fargo?
It does, honestly, that’s just who I am. I mean, it might influence in the fact that I do like to give the middle finger to almost every rule that I’m presented with
A lot of rules for music supervisors.
Oh my God, we have so many rules. We have to answer to so many people. I subvert whenever I can. I don’t get to do that much, though. If I slip a song in that doesn’t get slayed by the studio or network, I’m happy. I mean, the gift of FX is they really trust Noah. I could give an example on another TV show and another network, but yeah, it’s different with Fargo.
What was the most red tape you had to cut through or the most arduous negotiation process for any tracks?
My God, it’s actually, it’s so boring. There was some song that people don’t even know from a composer and Armenian Philharmonic Orchestra . It’s not anything that would register to the audience, but it was the hardest clearance I think I’ve ever had to do. We were denied. It was an Armenian composer that we could not get in contact with. I told Noah on the spot, like, “I don’t think we’re going to get clearance for this. They won’t respond. We’ve tried every avenue.” He called me afterwards and was like, “I have to get this.” He jokingly said, “Get on a plane.”
I have to shout out [music coordinator] Kristen Higuera, she set her alarm for multiple days in a row to call the Armenian Consulate. So, we asked them to find a contact that would clear a song that not many people know. It’s not the songs people would recognize, but it’s the songs that actually mean a lot because they add the texture to the show that is unusual and weird, and yeah, we got it.
I’ve never heard of a music supervisor who had to go through that.
I didn’t know if I could do it. I was like, okay, I’ll keep trying. That’s the part of the music supervisor world that people don’t know. It’s not glamorous. People want to hear about the creative part of choosing a song, but a lot of it is just tracking down rights and making sure you get the song that people want.
I’ve seen those countless email threads about trying to clear a song, and it is so boring.
It’s so boring and so tedious. It’s so time consuming.
Some of the major acts definitely want to be associated with Fargo, right?
With the majors with bands who know Fargo and they’re like, “Yeah, we’d love to be a part of that, but we’ll charge you this much.” I mean, it’s expensive. Music’s expensive.
So, early on you knew you had the ear for music, but when did you realize you also had the right negotiation skills and tactics to become a full-time music supervisor?
That’s a good question. I didn’t know. I had been doing it for five years and my brother, Ethan, who’s a business consultant, came and stayed with me in LA for some work. He happened to be hanging out 10 feet away from me while I was on the phone with someone trying to negotiate a deal. When I got off the phone, and he was like, “Maggie, you’re a business woman.” I was like, “No, I have no clue. I have no business training.”
For me, I was totally trained in arts. I had no clue what to do in the business end of things, but Ethan said, “You were really good on that call. You know what you’re doing.” And so, he actually was the one that encouraged me. There was a point in my life where I was trying to paint because painting was my dream. I was painting and doing music supervision, and he was like, “I think you need to stop painting and pursue music supervision full-time.”
That’s a good moment.
I never knew I had other skills I never knew I had, like organization, budget, and managing a team. I still don’t know if I know exactly how to do that, but I’ve developed.
At the beginning of your career, a Spoon song was your first option, right?
Yes.
They’re one of my favorite bands. You optioned a song of theirs for a dollar, too. How did you do that?
Oh my God. Britt will love this story. Britt Daniel is an old friend of mine. I just saw him the other day, and we were talking about how long it’s been. We’ve known each other for 25 years. Britt is a good friend and we have known each other in many different capacities over the past 20 years, 25 years. He was the first song I cleared for Puffy Chair. It was “The Way We Get By.”
Mark and Jay and Katie were making The Puffy Chair, which was the movie that got them signed to William Morris. It was a movie that they were shooting when I lived with Katie. They shot it at our apartment, and I thought they were making a home video. I had no clue what they were doing. I was like, “This is really cute. They’re making this movie.”
And then they were like, “Oh, we need a few songs.” I suggested a few songs, and then when they put the Spoon song in, they asked me to reach out to Britt because they knew I knew him. I got the song for a dollar. Let me tell you, and Brit would agree, I’ve paid him back. I’ve paid him back for that favor.
[Laughs] That’s a big song for a dollar.
And Britt is one of those… I was just talking to him about this. He’s writing his new album right now, and dude, we were talking about how many artists from the ’90s are still making albums that are relevant.
So consistent. They’re so consistent with quality too.
And it’s because he is a perfectionist. We went out to dinner and he wasn’t able to have a conversation. He was thinking about writing for the next album. I think his songwriting is stellar. He’s a great guy.
We could probably talk about Spoon for hours, but of course, I want to conclude with your work on Fargo. After years working on the show, what did you find most fulfilling as an artist about chapter five?
For me, it was a subject matter that I related to because of… I’m not a victim of domestic violence, but I’m a victim of sexual assault. I’m a survivor, and so, I really connected with Dot. I feel whenever I listen to characters, it’s all emotional. It’s all about the lyrics. Artists for me are like, how do I connect to the characters? And so, I really connected with Dot and felt like we represented her character well.
Also, this is a weird thing to say when you’re talking about being a survivor of any trauma, I think we added levity to it as well. We were able to respect her storyline, but then also have some fun with it. The gift of Fargo is you get to talk about dark subject matters and heavy subject matters, but then also have this levity. I mean, that’s what humanity is, right? That’s what it is to be a human. You laugh through the tears.
I think for me, that was the most gratifying part about this season of Fargo. And then also, it was just fun to have everyone respond to this season. I’ve been doing it for a decade, and you never know what people are going to respond to, so it was fun to have people really like this season.
Fargo is available to stream on Hulu.
